Lauren Esposito

Lizzy Russo: Awesome. Thank you. So I'm going to pull out my questions. But if you would like to tell me a little bit about what you do and what you are research centers on?

 

Lauren Esposito: Sure. I am the curator of a arachnology at the California Academy of Sciences, and my research is mainly focused on what I would call biodiversity science. So a lot of it is when you're talking about invertebrates in the world, a lot of it means like species discovery and like really basic documentation about what lives on Earth and where. But I'm also really interested in trying to do to leverage that kind of information for conservation purposes. And so helping people that are the responsible parties for environmental decision-making have tools that they can use for planning purposes that are rooted in in biodiversity data from the ground, rather than satellite data or any of the other like really common kinds of data that people use about land use, and so like tying that directly to what's on the ground and what lives there.

 

Lizzy Russo: Awesome, that's super cool. That's kind of what I've been interested in at school is biodiversity.

 

Lauren Esposito: That's awesome.

 

Lizzy Russo: So how did you get involved in conservation?

 

Lauren Esposito: I mean, you know, I think I started when I went to grad school. I did my degree at a natural history museum called the American Museum of Natural History, which is in New York. And. I like was really sort of ivory tower like I did research and I worked in a genetics lab and I like sat in my office all day and worked on papers for publication and I didn't really think much about conservation, but it was something that was really present on my mind when I was in the field doing fieldwork because I saw the consequences of human-mediated change. I specialize then and now still on islands, particularly tropical islands in the new world so most of the Caribbean Islands and the effects of change particularly change like post-colonial change largely driven by intensive agriculture using enslaved people labor is quite stark, like you really see the consequence of that, most notably in the absence of huge forests, the sort of barren empty agricultural fields that are no longer being actively used. So I think during that period of time when I was in grad school, I really realized that I wanted to do something more than just be a scientist, that I felt like I needed to intervene somehow and enact change in some way, even if it was minor, and I started doing like more and more outreach. Then during my postdoc, I started doing outreach while I was doing expeditions. So I did tons of fieldwork as a postdoc, I spent like six months out of the year in the field, and during that period of time, like I was, I started doing education in the communities where I was doing fieldwork and realized the power of just the access to that information, like it's information that most communities simply don't have access to, about like what lives around them and the uniqueness of those things. And so during that time, my closest friend who I had met in grad school and I. Started having these conversations about what we could do as biodiversity scientists to make a difference as sort of natural historians. We decided that we would start a nonprofit, and the nonprofit would focus on providing access to places for scientists, which are normally really difficult to access, but also to provide access to scientific information for local communities that typically don't have that kind of access and are the decision makers for their for their environment. And so I would say that that was sort of the beginning of me as a conservationist. Prior to that, I was really more of a traditional scientist on less of somebody who was involved in communities and involved in trying to create change for the world. And so I still help from this nonprofit with Eric, my partner in the nonprofit, and he and I built a field station in a really remote part of Baja California, Sur in Mexico. And I now I'm trying to imagine ways to scale that kind of stuff. And so I think ever since I've made that conscientious decision to start on a, I guess I would call it a new path, I have tried to integrate that into my primary research as much as possible.

 

Lizzy Russo: That is all super cool. Like, Wow, I love that. And then my next question is, what has your journey been like to success as an LGBTQ person in the science field?

 

Lauren Esposito: Yeah, that question is a good one. I think, you know, the short answer is that my journey to success was not as an LGBTQ person, it was as, I wouldn't say I was closeted, but it was like as a person who didn't talk about that aspect of their identity in the in a professional context. All of grad school and slightly less so during my postdoc, but certainly still, I didn't ever reveal that aspect of my identity to any of the people that I wasn't having already in a familiar relationship with. So, of course my lab mates and PI’s eventually realized that I was queer, but it wasn't like something I led with, and it was definitely not something that I brought my whole queer self when I came to work. And it wasn't really until I got a permanent position, which is a place of quite a lot of privilege that I was like, okay, well, I'm queer and like, I'm ready for everybody to know that about me because I'm tired of uncomfortable conversations at work about my identity and like my family and how those people fit together with who I am and I also had this sort of revelation, I guess I would say, which is that I had a permanent position as a P.I., and I work in an institution in San Francisco, which is a super, super gay friendly place, and it's also a very old institution. It's the oldest natural history museum west of the Mississippi. It's the oldest scientific institution in California, and we had never had an openly queer curator in our history. So one hundred and sixty five years or so, there had never been an openly queer curator like, OK, of course, for many of those years, like there was nobody openly queer period. But even in the last like since then, since the 1970s, like when Harvey Milk was a legislator in the city of San Francisco, people were living, lives openly queer without issue, and we still didn't have an openly queer curator working at this institution. So if I couldn't be open and queer in a really gay friendly place, people in other places must be experiencing the same thing. And I also realized that I had never met another queer arachnologist, but I certainly had met them, we just didn't talk about that, and there was like a reason that we didn't talk about that. And the reason was that everybody's told through these like cultural norms that get passed along that are all unspoken that that's not something you talk about at work in science and sciences you should, just like people's common responses like, well, I don't care about that, I just care about your science. And it's like, Okay, well, that's that's fine but the reality is, is the way that I do science and the way that I approach science is a direct result of my identity and who I am. It shapes how I frame questions it shapes how I interpret data, and it makes me a better scientist, so why shouldn't we be celebrating that aspect of who of who we are as people? And so I think that that revelation, I guess I'll say, is really the thing that that made me realize it like. It did matter that I was queer at work and it mattered because it helps my science and it and that in turn, it progresses the body of knowledge that we hold as a human race forward. And so, so yeah, I think it has shaped me. I just hadn't ever stopped to consider it.

 

Lizzy Russo: Yeah, yeah, that makes sense. Then, so do you think it's important for more LGBTQ plus people to be involved in wildlife conservation and other conservation fields?

 

Lauren Esposito: I mean, yes, absolutely I do. I do for, you know, for similar reasons that I just mentioned, like because of people's perspectives. They ask questions differently. They might approach problems differently. I think also for most LGBTQ people, they really have a have a different understanding of the importance of community because oftentimes, like many of us have created our own community in our own families, and so in turn, we understand the importance of a community's involvement in decision making and the sort of autonomy over that decision making that the community needs. But I also think that it's tricky because for many conservation related issues one of the things that's involved is like going to the place where the conservation is happening. And like oftentimes, those places aren't safe for LGBTQ identifying people, either physically not safe, like people are in are in danger of like bodily harm or harassment, or even legally not safe because of their identities. And so I think it's also as important as it is,it's also a really tricky issue because like not many people who are not LGBTQ recognize the personal safety issues related to being queer in the field, particularly for trans or gender non-conforming folks, which means that it could be super dangerous to be in the field in like Alabama, right where it's like it is legal to be queer, but like that doesn't mean that it's safe. And so I think, yes, we need more LGBTQ people, but also we need to find a way to keep them safe and for people to be cognizant of those safety issues.

 

Lizzy Russo: Yeah, that's those are great points, some that I hadn't thought about before. And do you think LGBTQ people specifically can contribute to wildlife conservation or have perspectives that can help with conservation?

 

Lauren Esposito: Yeah, I mean, I think for sure, I think oftentimes like the way that we interpret natural history of organisms is like a super white, straight, cisgendered male perspective and so in that sense, like it's really important that we have a thorough understanding of the natural history of organisms or landscapes that we're trying to conserve, but when those natural histories have been interpreted through a single lens, we don't actually necessarily have the best picture of what's going on, like, for example, gender differences that might be necessary or sex differences that might be necessary in terms of conserving an animal or a plant that have only been interpreted through the cisgender heterosexual lens. And so I think that that that LGBTQ people actually absolutely have a role to play and a perspective that's necessary for the future of conservation, particularly when it pertains to interpretation of gender and gender roles in natural history.

 

Lizzy Russo: Yeah, for sure, that's something that I've come across in my research that's been definitely interesting to see and exciting to come across, so I'm glad you brought that up. And then do you have any suggestions for young people who are grappling with their LGBTQ identity, who are interested in pursuing interests or a job in the science field?

 

Lauren Esposito: Yeah, I mean, my advice is that that we're here. Like, there are LGBTQ people out here and who are making huge strides forward in terms of pushing the boundaries of knowledge of science and there's absolutely a place for you and that doesn't have to mean choosing between your passion as a scientist and your identity as an LGBTQ person that those two things can live in the same room at the same time. So don't ever feel like that is a choice that has to be made because it doesn't. And I think that the current generation of young scientists is just pushing that boundary further and faster and if people ever want to know that they're not alone, like I develop this resource called 500 Queer Scientists, and you can just go in there and look up the field of conservation and find a whole bunch of people that are that are out and proud as conservation biologists and able to share to share their story.

 

Lizzy Russo: That's awesome. I haven't come across that yet. I'll have to also take a look at that.

 

Lauren Esposito: Yeah, you should. It's a visibility campaign that I started in 2018, and we have like over sixteen hundred contributions of scientists from around the world.

 

Lizzy Russo: Wow, that's awesome. I will definitely have to look at that because it will help my research more too.

 

Lauren Esposito: Yeah, you can buy no one of people that way, I'm sure.

 

Lizzy Russo: Yeah. Well, that is all the questions that I have. So I think that's all. Thank you so much for letting me interview you.

 

Lauren Esposito: Yeah, really great to meet you too. And good luck. Good luck with your research. And if I can be of help in any way like I do have like pretty good reach within the queer community and could even potentially connect you to some queer folks who are not necessarily out because of, like country-related concerns about their LGBTQ identity where they do conservation work. But they would probably be willing to speak with you about their work.

 

Lizzy Russo: All right, great. Thank you so much.

 

Lauren Esposito: Sure, take it easy.

 

Lizzy Russo: Thanks you too.